[Moo] Same Gender Corsort Proposal from SCA Announcement List

Sun Feb 5 14:07:32 PST 2012

Marcolo,

  Thanks for the clarification and thanks for making my point.    The *reason* for why you discriminate is what may be bad.   As I said, I am objecting to the statement that discrimination is *always* bad.

I made absolutely no comparison of same gender relationships to anything else.   Read my note again carefully, and see that I made no such comparison.   In fact, I clarified the only point I was making.

However, since you are concerned about removing a perceived discrmination in how the SCA conducts its Crown Tournaments, are you interested in removing *all* discrimination in how we conduct Crown Tournaments??    If we removed that perceived form of discrimination, are we also going to remove the perceived discrimination against rapier fighters, archers, equestrians, or artisans?

Some people believe we discriminate against all those folks in how we determine our Crown...

cheers,

  Terafan

________________________________
From: moo-bounces at lists.stierbach.org [moo-bounces at lists.stierbach.org] on behalf of Marcolo DelMare [marcolobronzethunder at gmail.com]
Sent: Thursday, February 02, 2012 6:13 PM
To: General Mailing List for the Barony of Stierbach
Subject: Re: [Moo] Same Gender Corsort Proposal from SCA Announcement List

Really? you are honestly comparing same gender relationships with rape, murder and incest? This is insulting and ignorant and using semantics to avoid the topic. Let me rephrase.

Discrimination based on Race, Religion, Gender, Sexual Orientation or National Origin is immoral, bad, shameful and disgusting.

The thing about medieval reenactment is we get to recreate the fun things about the middle ages without having to live through the crappy things. I like air conditioning, showering and modern medicine. I don't mind learning about blood letting and leach craft, but if I get sick I want to go to a modern doctor and get x-rays and medicine. Yes slavery existed in the middle ages, but I have no interest in that being portrayed in my leisure activities.

Marcolo

On Thu, Feb 2, 2012 at 10:23 AM, Barclay, Peter C LTC USA CIO/G6 <Peter.c.Barclay at us.army.mil<https://mail.atid.army.mil/owa/UrlBlockedError.aspx>> wrote:

Greetings from Terafan,

Marcolo said: "Discrimination is always bad, always every time"

Not true at all!  We discriminate every single day, but for good reason.   For example, we don't allow someone to marry their sister... and we usually don't allow known murderers or rapists to freely walk the streets (without having paid duly for their crimes).

To discriminate is to make a distinction.    Most of us believe that murder, theft, and rape is bad.  However, some people think it is OK for them to do those things.    However, we discriminate against them and their beliefs and tell them that if they choose to do those things and we convict them in a court of law, then we put them in jail.

That is "discrimination".    We just usually don't call it that, because the word "discrimination" is emotionally charged.

My only point is that discrimination is NOT *always* bad.   I discriminate (make distinctions) many, many times every single day.   None of those are bad.    For example, if I choose Chik-Fil-A over McDonalds because I prefer chicken over beef, then I am discriminating against them simply because "I don't like that"...     However, we consider this perfectly acceptable "discrimination".

Discrimination is not necessarily bad.  The *reason* for which you discriminate is what could be bad, but not every reason is bad.

cheers,

   Terafan

Master Rhys Terafan Greydragon, OL, OP

________________________________
From: moo-bounces at lists.stierbach.org<https://mail.atid.army.mil/owa/UrlBlockedError.aspx> [moo-bounces at lists.stierbach.org<https://mail.atid.army.mil/owa/UrlBlockedError.aspx>] on behalf of Marcolo DelMare [marcolobronzethunder at gmail.com<https://mail.atid.army.mil/owa/UrlBlockedError.aspx>]
Sent: Thursday, February 02, 2012 6:26 AM
To: General Mailing List for the Barony of Stierbach
Subject: Re: [Moo] Same Gender Corsort Proposal from SCA Announcement List

   No it doesn't need to address that possibility. I would much rather be abused by cheaters than make ourselves bigots. Discrimination is always bad, always every time. I don't want discrimination against mixed racial couples, people with non christian personas, same gender couples or anyone else.
  And to stop the two Duke scenario, only one member of a couple may fight in any crown tournament. If you are accepting someone to fight for you to be sovereign or consort then you may not fight. And if you have been sovereign OR consort you may not fight in the next crown. This way if a pair of Dukes want to team up then it reduces the chance of one of them winning crown because only one of them will be able to fight.

~M

On Thu, Feb 2, 2012 at 5:43 AM, Dante di Pietro <dante.di.pietro at gmail.com<https://mail.atid.army.mil/owa/UrlBlockedError.aspx>> wrote:

One thing to keep in mind is that they had to include some kind of protection against the scenario where two dukes decide to fight together, double their odds so two more do, and so on. Without some kind of method of prevention, it would be POSSIBLE, if however UNLIKELY, to have a kingdom with no queen for years. Whatever issues there might be with the proposed language, and alternatives must address that possibility.

On Feb 2, 2012 5:07 AM, "Marcolo DelMare" <marcolobronzethunder at gmail.com<https://mail.atid.army.mil/owa/UrlBlockedError.aspx>> wrote:
What a pile of crap. We are going to miss the opportunity to correct discrimination verbage, and instead change the style of the discrimination. Oh how big of us to say if you want you don't have to discriminate but we prefer it if you do.

Marcolo

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